Get Fit At Any Age: It's Never Too Late w/ Susan Neibergall

00:00Every single one of us should be focused on building strength and muscle. And that doesn't mean you have to be a bodybuilder. And I think that's another thing that we get in our heads. We're going to get big, big and bulky, like, you know, the Hulk or something like that. And I got to tell you that that ain't got to happen. Exactly. What's up, you guys? Welcome back to The WarriorBabe Show. Or if you are new, welcome to the show. Today, you are all in here for a special treat. We have another inspiring guest here with us, owner of Susan Niebergal. I'm not butchering that. I'm not Niebergal Fitness. Okay.

00:42And co-coach with the awesome Jordan Syatt in the Inner Circle. Susan is a woman who empowers all women and all people, really, that they can get fit at any age. And it's never too late. And that's also the name of her incredible book to you guys. We'll dive into all that amazing things. But at 62 years young, she has a rocking body, such an incredible body. And I'm excited to have her here on the show with us today to share her story and so many of their good insights that I feel like are just going to come from this podcast. So welcome to the show, Susan.

01:17Thank you. Wow. Thank you for all that, by the way. And the name, great Niebergal. You know, I've been called all kinds of things. So it's weird. Good. I'm glad I didn't butcher it. It's all good. And thank you for having me. I'm really looking forward to having this conversation. Amazing. Cool. So Susan, tell us a little bit more about you and what you do. So I am an online strength coach. I have a business called Susan Niebergal Fitness, which is where I started in the industry, on the online industry. And I'm also running the Inner Circle with Jordan Syatt.

01:54He and I run a big online fitness community together. And that's currently the status of what I'm doing right now. Not really doing too much one-on-one stuff and that kind of thing right now, as most of my coaching is all in the Inner Circle. And that's my focus. You know, it's kind of interesting. Life just takes you in different directions and you focus on different things at different times. And that's kind of where I'm at right now. And I'm loving every single second of it. Amazing. Awesome. So we were catching up here before we hopped into actually hitting the record button for you guys.

02:26But you shared that you've made every mistake in the book with fitness, but you were able to turn it around in your 50s. So do you mind sharing what those mistakes were with us and how you did turn it around? Wow. Where do I begin on this? You know, I started this, I guess to back up for a second, I have always been on the heavy side. I've never been obese, but I've always had weight to lose. Always, since I was a kid up through young adulthood and never understood ever how to do it.

02:58And as a young adult, I went to Jenny Craig, which I just heard today, they're shutting their doors permanently as of this week, which is like crazy because they've been around for, you know, 40 years almost. Wow. But for those that don't know, Jenny Craig, those of you that are my age, you know exactly who Jenny Craig is. But for those of you that may not, it is just kind of a meal plan company where you buy their food and then eat it and then you lose weight. And essentially, that's what happened with me. And when you do that on the surface, this is like, great, right? I lost all this weight.

03:29But the issue is, at least back then, I learned nothing about what I was doing. I didn't know how much I was eating. I didn't, I just ate this food, this food on this little tray that they told me to eat. And I was hungry all the time. That's pretty much what I learned. I lost the weight. And of course, I couldn't keep it off. I had no idea how to keep it off. And the only way after that I knew to lose weight was basically eat virtually nothing and be hungry all the time. That was in my brain. So that's the first big mistake is kind of thinking that I have to overly reduce my calories to next to nothing in order to lose weight.

04:06I think other mistakes I've made throughout the years is thinking I couldn't eat fat. That fat, dietary fat was the same fat that's in my body. And it's, I can't eat it. Because if I eat it, it's just going to turn to fat. Like fat was bad. So we went through the whole no fat kind of time. And all the while carbs were worked in and out as the devil. You know, they've always been the devil, poor carbs. You know, if you really think about it, carbs never get a break. And they haven't had a break in 40 years. I know. So I made that mistake.

04:36Did stuff like Slim Fast. Went through a big, long period of Slim Fast, right? And I thought, well, I'm just going to pair like Cheerios or some healthy cereal with it. And that was my thing for so long. I also, way back in the day, had, I took these appetite suppressants, I guess. They look like little chocolate candies. Oh, my God. And I think they were called AIDS, A-Y-D-S. Somebody told me that because I couldn't remember. And they were nothing more than pieces of chocolate, essentially. They did absolutely nothing.

05:08And then I think another mistake I made over the years is being a clean eater. And while there's nothing wrong with eating nutrient-dense foods and being aware of that, but when you only eat that for fear of eating anything else, because if you eat anything else, you're going to lose your progress or get fat. But that's where I was with it. I think that's where a lot of us have been with clean eating. Like, I can't eat out of my little clean food bubble. But those are the ones that come up top of my head right away.

05:41And, you know, they're very common. I think a lot of people have tried something like Jenny Craig or did low fat or low carb or no carb or this diet or that diet that is no carb or whatever. We've all done these things. And my message is just doesn't matter how many times that you mess up, how many mistakes you made. You can always turn it around. Yeah, I love that so much. And especially coming from what you grew up with with Jenny Craig and, you know, Slim Fast. And I think Weight Watchers was in there too as well.

06:11And like all of those things, women connected with that message and that marketing. Right. And it's like, let's be skinny. Let's look skinny. Let's eat this diet to get skinny. Right. And it's like not to any women's fault there or your fault there that you tried all of those things. That's just what was known back then. Right. Yes, it was. Skinny was the thing. Yeah. That word in particular. It was that word. Like I wanted to be skinny my whole life. You know, and the irony is when I started changing my body around and I lost a lot of weight and built

06:42this muscle, I was I was skinny. And I look at myself and that was only four or five years ago. I look at myself back then. I'm thinking, you know, I liked it for a time because I finally I felt like I finally got there. But I didn't I look back on that. I'm going, wow, you were thin. But then I got deemed skinny fat. Right. Yeah. All of those terms. All of that. So then, OK, you were in those speak mistakes, but like lessons learned. Right. So talk to us on like that latter half of your journey and where you are now at 62 and like

07:16what made you turn it around? What were the strategies? What were the things that you started implementing there? I think the biggest thing was I stopped blaming everything else for my lack of success. I was queen of that. My queen of that. Yeah. Right. I blamed my age. I blamed menopause. I would blame. I don't even know. I was constantly a victim. And so because of that, I never really made any progress.

07:48And I think I kept in that cycle because it's hard to face the truth. It's hard to be honest with yourself and tell yourself, you know what? You have not been doing what you need to do to reach the goal that you want to reach. For decades, not just, oh, yeah, last month you screwed up. No, this is for the majority of your life. And that is a it's more than a pill to swallow. I don't know. It really took a lot of reflection and acceptance and that I'm not an idiot, you know, because

08:22I was like, what an idiot, you know, I've done all this for so long and none of it was the kind of the direction I should be going in. But in fairness, it was what we knew back then. You know, it was the information we were getting. So had went and had the doctor's appointment who confirmed that all my blood works fine. You know, I don't have a low thyroid. I don't love metabolism. You know, I blamed all of those things that can be under menopause. And when I finally my last kind of scapegoat left, you know, I couldn't really blame it

08:57on that. That's when I had to start, yeah, looking at myself. And it was a hard, hard pill to swallow. It took it took a little bit of time. But when I did, I started making small little changes. I didn't even track. I just paid attention to how much I was eating because that ultimately was the problem. And so I made small changes there. I was working with some trainers along the way. Loved working out in the gym. Wanted to do powerlifting. And that's when I hired Jordan.

09:28And Jordan is my personal coach. And we started working together maybe when I was 55, something in somewhere in there. It's been a long time. We were just talking about this the other day. So it was a long time. 55-ish, something like that. And from that moment on, everything changed. I became a student. I became a great student. I, you know, you tell me to jump six feet, I'm jumping six feet. You know, I am. You tell me to send you videos, I'm sending you videos. I do what I'm told to do. And I had finally had structure.

09:59And I started reading and watching everything that he put out. And it made so much sense. And while I didn't go to him for nutrition, we ended up working with nutrition a little bit as we went along. But I usually did the nutrition he would put out in his inner circle. I joined it early on, in the very early days as a member. And I would just kind of implement stuff from there. And he was coaching me. And he took me through a whole different way of working out where I finally started making progress.

10:30And everything just kind of catapulted from there. And along the way, I'm learning. I'm relearning things. You know, you have to unlearn some things. You have to relearn other things. And I guess a big takeaway for me was the emotion that's tied to all of these things for us, you know, from decades is still there for me. You know, the scale fluctuations are a great example. Yeah. I hate it when I see the scale go up, you know. It's emotional for so many of us.

11:02You know, because of my generation, we didn't talk about fluctuations. We didn't know anything about that. It was just it went up. That's bad. It goes down. That's good. That's what we knew. So to this day, when it goes up, I still get a little kick in the gut. But the difference now is I have control over the emotion. I don't let the emotion like ruin everything because I understand it now. I understand what's happening. I didn't for 40 years, you know. So I think that that's a big difference is we still have the emotion.

11:33I don't think it's ever going to go away ever. I don't think. But we learn how to manage it and can move on. You know, it's just like, OK, I don't like that. OK, whatever. Yes. Oh, my God. Everything that you just said there to unpack it really quick. First, you spoke of the victim mentality, which, you know, I love that you broke through and start taking ownership and responsibility for your actions because you're the one in control of everything. Right. Yeah. Ladies, are you feeling frustrated with body changes you're experiencing during menopause?

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12:39Take charge of your health and join our community of strong, empowered women. Visit WarriorBabe.com forward slash apply today to start your transformation. That's WarriorBabe.com forward slash apply. All right. Let's get back to the show. And then the second thing to unpack there is that you hired an amazing coach and there's so many benefits to working with a good coach. Yeah. And then the last thing that I love is the scale. And I was on your Instagram too, checking out your page, which I love too, by the way.

13:12And there was a post that you shared on that as well, which I love that you have because there's like three pillars that I say with the scale. It's like, let me first figure out behaviorally where we're at, where I'm at with this human. How are you connected to the emotions of the scale? Do you step on it and your emotions fluctuate either if it goes down or up, you feel great or you feel negative. And then maybe we can just use it. If we can pass that, use it as just a tool, which are the things that you're talking about. And then what I saw on your Instagram was the data points, right? So can you share with the audience when you're looking at using the scale and then wanting

13:48it to attach it to progress, what it would look like at 30 days, what you share on your post? Sure. I'm a big proponent of weighing in every day. And I know a lot of people are like, oh, I don't want to weigh in every day. But I'll tell you what, I think you're doing yourself a real disservice if you don't. Because if you think about it, over the course of 30 days, you weigh in every single day, the same time every single day, you have 30 data points or 31 data points that you can step back and look at and kind of graph.

14:20And a lot of these apps graph it for you right now. You can see a trend line. Is the trend line going down? Is it going up? Is it laying flat? You have so many data points to look at. So if you go to once a week, which tends to be a real popular alternative with people, here's the big problem with once a week. You weigh in on a Friday. That's weigh in day. It now has, it sits on a pedestal. It is an event. It's not part of your everyday life. It is now an event. And let's say weigh in day is Friday and it's Tuesday and you've gotten off track a little

14:52bit and you're not feeling great about where you are and you know you have to step on the scale in like two days. Guess what you're probably going to do for the next two days. You're not going to do what your plan is. That's for sure. You're going to change everything. You're going to overly restrict, maybe do a lot more exercising, cardio, whatever, just so the scale will read a number that you think is favorable. And so what you've done is you've completely negated the value of that weigh in that day. It means absolutely nothing anymore because you've changed everything just to try to dictate

15:25what that scale is going to do. You're trying to take control over it. And the odd part about that is the irony maybe is that you can't control it. You know, I mean, it's impossible to control. And so it also is a problem because if you weigh in on Friday and let's say it's up a pound, what you don't see is what happened from last Friday. You don't see, oh, the trend line is actually going down. But you happen to step on it on a Friday, on a Friday that you're holding on to some water

15:56for whatever reason. And there's a million reasons why our bodies hold on to water. And so you're thinking, oh, wow, I gained a pound of fat. That's another thing. You're thinking you gained fat that fast, you know. But you're thinking you gained a pound of fat when in essence you really didn't. You're just holding on to some water. And if you had weighed in every single day, you would have seen all the different fluctuations. So while granted it's hard for someone, again, in my age bracket in particular, but any age bracket,

16:29when you are very emotional about that number and you have a lot of history with this, it is tough. It is tough to remove the emotion. But I find what I have done with this, and I still do it to this day, if I feel it starting to creep up a little bit more, I just say, Susan, shut up. You are fine. You did not eat over 3,500 calories over my maintenance yesterday. I did not do that. So the scale reflection today has zero to do with that, you know.

17:03I tell myself that once in a while when it gets kind of crazy in my head too, you know. I love that. And I just feel like we all need to do that. And it's an awareness, and it's a little tough love too. You got to tell yourself to shut up. Because if you don't, the emotion that's going in your head is going to take over. And here's the other thing I like to say. We all have logic voices in our head too, but they're sitting in the back. You know, they're lounging in a lazy boy while the emotions are just having fun and messing with you and saying,

17:36God, look, you screwed up, man. Your scale's up a pound. You need to shut up emotion and get logic voices up off the lazy boy to tell emotion to shut the hell up. Yes. Susan, I love it. I love it. I love the direct bluntness too as well. Like that is me and that's the audience. So they're going to really accept that. Because that's me too. Yes. And Jordan too. You guys are all, I love it. I love it. Okay. So all great stuff there. Now I know that strength and building muscle is something that you love to help your people do.

18:10So why is it so beneficial to do those things? Wow. I mean, gosh, the list is like so long. But the basic stuff is building strength and muscle is going to lead us all to a much more functional life as we get older. You know, be thinking grandkids, getting up and down off the floor, going up and down steps, sitting, you know, standing. All those kinds of basic life things that we want to be able to do for as long as possible.

18:42And not only live longer, but with a quality of life. And that's what strength training will bring to the table. And there's so much research out right now that is showing that that is like the number one thing for longevity. Yes. Daniel, Dr. Gabriel Lyons, the organ of longevity is muscle. Yes. And Dr. Peter Atiyah, I almost finished his book. His book is unbelievable about longevity. I'm sorry. What's the book title? It's called Outlive.

19:12Outlive. It's unbelievable. And it is basically saying that exercise, strength training in particular is like the thing for all of us to be doing. And even if you're not a strength training fan, you'd rather do other things. I get it. That's cool. Do other things. But strength training is too important to not include in some way, shape or form in what you're doing. And it's also going, obviously, it's going to build muscle mass. And when you have muscle mass on you, your quality of life as you get older is going to be much better.

19:48It's going to increase the strength of your bones. Bone density can improve. And here's the interesting thing. We can build muscle as we get older, too. We used to think, no, we're done with building muscle at a certain age. That's not true. Is it harder for us? Yeah, it probably is going to be a little bit harder for us. But we can always do it. And so it's too important not to even try that, especially this bone density thing, which I don't think we talk about enough. Because how many times have we seen elderly people fall and break it up?

20:19You are literally speaking my language right now. I literally speak about this all of the time. Osteoproces, postmenopause. All of the estrogen is dropping. I used to, as I shared with you, worked in the ER. I was in a long-term nursing care facility for nine years. And the amount of people that I saw coming into the hospital with hip fractures and falling, it's scary. So, yeah, it's just scary. It's so scary. And, you know, your chances of not breaking something.

20:53First of all, your chances of not falling have gone up dramatically, right? If you're stronger, you're more stable, you know? But even if you should fall, the chances of you breaking something are going down so much because now you've built up your bone density. So, to put it all in a nutshell, I think those are all the reasons why every single one of us should be focused on building strength and muscle. And that doesn't mean you have to be a bodybuilder. And I think that's another thing that we get in our heads. We're going to get big, big and bulky like, you know, the Hulk or something like that.

21:26And I got to tell you, that ain't going to happen. Exactly. I mean, none of us have to worry about that ever, ever, ever, ever. Yeah, exactly. And this is just a myth that a lot of women have in their head, you know, and then social media and all of the things. Well, and I also think, too, because I think when people think of strength and muscle, they see a lot of power lifting. And when you see a lot of strong power lifting girls, a lot of them are bigger. And they're purposefully bigger. They've done this purposefully to go for their goals.

21:59Right. So their nutrition has been shifted very differently than most of us would probably eat to accommodate their goal. And that's what I feel like so many people see as building muscle. And it's not. It's not what building muscle is about. And so I think that adds to the problem with the whole bulking thing. Yeah, I totally agree. Or, you know, the people that are in the bodybuilding world and they admire the bodybuilders that are on stage. And they're probably not entirely all natural. So there's that, too, as well.

22:30But, yeah, you're spot on with what you just said. So when it comes to building muscle and when it comes to, like, working out, what do you feel like are the common mistakes that people make? And then when they're trying to do that and then how can they be avoided? Yeah, I think so. One common mistake is people don't follow a program. Right. They're going to an F45 or an Orange Siri and thinking their little weight segment is enough. And I will say this. If you're starting from zero and, you know, it's you like being in that community, do it.

23:02Do it. Do it. Do it. But that kind of weight training versus a strength training program that's structured and organized are two very different things. And the results that most people want are going to come from a structured strength training program, which a lot of people don't have. You know, so that is one mistake is not is doing all classes and getting frustrated that you're not making the progress you want to see. You're just not doing quite the right kind of training. And so a structured strength training program is is where where I think everybody needs to be.

23:37And if you're new to it, you know, hire a personal trainer in person to start you, you know, so you have that person there who can show you around the gym, who can show you how to lift appropriately, you know, for you and your your level and show you how to do it safely and effectively. And then eventually you can do it on your own and you can join all kinds of groups and whatever and get programs written for you and and that kind of thing and do it on your own. But I think following a program is one of the biggest.

24:07I also think that people aren't lifting enough weight. Hey, hey, just want to drop a huge appreciation to you guys listening to the show. It means a lot. I hope you guys are enjoying it and there's so much more to come with it. If you are enjoying it, hit the subscribe button. I'd appreciate that tons. And also it would help this podcast reach others who need to hear these messages, too. Thanks so much, guys. Let's get back to the show. Yes. I think louder. I mean, you're stronger than you think.

24:38I guarantee it. It's so funny. I see somebody pick up a 20 pound dumbbell. I'm using this just as an example. Yeah. Not for anybody to gauge your weight or anything like this. A 20 pound dumbbell, they're doing a dumbbell row and those rows are moving. Right. They're going fast. Rep number one looks exactly like rep number 10. And they keep using that weight. Yes. And I'm like, uh-uh. You're speaking my language here. Let's go. Keep going. I know. Right. It's so frustrating.

25:09Yeah. You don't stick with that weight. If this is me and I use that 20 and I've got 10 reps, okay, that next set, I'm going to 25. And if I can get 25, that next set, I'm going to 30. You know, I am pushing the envelope. And then I always get asked, but what if I can't get all of the reps with 25? Okay. So let's say you got 5 out of 10 with 25. This is what I do. Not everyone has to do this. But okay, I got 5 out of 10. I'll put down the 20 and I'll get that, I mean, I'll put down the heavier weight.

25:42I'll go get that lighter weight, the 20, and I'm going to finish the reps. Heck yeah. I'll do 5 more. I agree. So I need to end at 10. Yes. You know, it says 10. I want to end at 10. I write in my notes. I did 5 at 25, 5 at 20. Now, my goal moving forward is to get all of those, all that next set at 20, at 25 pounds. So I'm constantly pushing the envelope with weight. And I feel like people don't do that enough.

26:12And that's why most people are not seeing the results they want to see, is that they're just not pushing themselves enough. And then the last big mistake is you're constantly dieting, constantly dieting, trying to lose weight in a calorie deficit, eating virtually nothing, expecting that you're going to be able to build a crap ton of muscle and are hoping you're afraid to eat in maintenance, much less a surplus, you know?

26:43And I think that's a dieting mindset that was probably validated over decades, you know? It is something that's going to be hard to combat. It's scary putting up calories when you've fought your whole life to get the scale to go down. Now you're trying to get it to go up, you know? It's a scary thing. But I feel like you have to eat to support your goals, too. You can't always be in a calorie deficit and expect to see definition in your muscles.

27:14Yeah. Love it. Everything that you just said there is 110%. I love, especially too, with working out and not pushing yourself enough. It's like you're just going through the motions. And I tell people, if you just want to go through the motions, then just expect the same type of results that you're getting right now, because ain't nothing going to happen from that. Do you make ugly faces when you work out, Susan? All the time. And I make noises, too, a lot of time. And it's so funny, because on one of the posts I just put up, that was one of the criteria. Are you lifting enough weight? Are you making funny faces?

27:45That's not scientific, but I'll tell you, there's a lot of truth behind that, actually. Because as I said at the beginning, if Rep 8, 9, and 10 look very similar to Rep 1, 2, and 3, you are doing yourself a disservice. There's no rules police here. There's no one that's going to say, well, if you can't do all three sets with 25 pounds, you better not even try. There's nobody there that's saying that. You need to get out of your own way and go pick up that heavier dumbbell.

28:17I'm constantly testing the waters. Every time I go to the gym, let me see what I got today. Because sometimes I surprise myself. Most of the time I can tell what kind of day it's going to be, because I've done this long enough now. I understand if I don't have the energy, if I'm not feeling it, whatever. But there are some times where, okay, I did this the other day. I tried 50-pound dumbbells on a bench press, and I got a couple reps. I was completely shocked. I haven't done that in a long time. I've been working my way back to that. So you never know, right?

28:49You never know. I think we are all stronger than we think. Absolutely. A hundred percent. So you touched there, too, on the last mistake that people make as a nutrition and constantly dieting. So I want to ask you, what is the importance of, like, discuss the importance of proper nutrition when it comes to building muscle? So the optimal way to build muscle is eating in what's called calorie surplus, eating a little bit more than your body needs to maintain its weight.

29:20And I think when we hear surplus or we hear, I'm going into a bulking phase. That's awful, by the way. I've never said that. But that's what people call it. We get this idea of, like, okay, I'm eating. I like to call it a building phase. Building sounds better than a bulking. So I like to call it build. Yes, building sounds so much better. And when we're in, if we're in a surplus to feed that, it's just a little, it's a snitch more than your maintenance, you know? And that's the amount that you eat.

29:51And you kind of hover in this little maintenance bubble of anywhere from one to four or five pounds. You just kind of play around in that area. That's where I've been living for years. Same three, four pounds for me. Some people's maintenance range is larger. Larger, others can be a little bit smaller. But we're only talking a smidge over that. We're not talking about hundreds and thousands of calories more that you have to stuff down and feel so full. That's in our head, right? That's not, we have kind of taken something and blown it way out of proportion. But I feel like not enough people spend time in maintenance.

30:25Yes. Learning how to live. Maintenance is magic. Maintenance is magic. And it's interesting. I think people don't like it because the word implies you're kind of stagnant. You're just, you're in this maintaining mode. And in the inner circle, Jordan and I nicknamed it momentum. Because we really feel like this is a time where you are building momentum. You're building confidence. You're building nutritional momentum to either keep going if you want to go into a surplus, to maybe even go back into a deficit if you're still in that phase.

30:56Or to just get used to learning about living in this world of maintenance or momentum. It's a learning stage. And it's the place where you should spend most of your life, to be perfectly honest. And you can build muscle in this stage. And the cool thing is, if you get rid of all these unrealistic expectations and timelines, you throw those out the window. So maintenance is my preferred way to build muscle, to be honest. Because it's just you living your life, having fun, giving yourself some goals in the gym,

31:30some very specific goals in the gym, and work towards those and have fun doing it. I mean, that's what it's kind of all about. Yes. You're speaking my language, Susan. I love it. Let's go. Maintenance is magic, man. And it's so true. A lot of people think, and I think it's just correlated to that diet mindset that a lot of people have. They have to eat less. They have to be in deficits. They want to lose the fat, want to lose the weight. And there's a common question that I get that I would love to ask you is, can you build muscle when you're in a deficit?

32:02You know, and there's a lot of nuance to this question, I think. I think everyone wants to lose weight and build muscle. Not everyone, but a lot of people want to do that. And I think it depends on where you're at. If you have a lot of weight to lose, and I don't even want to put a number on that because people will take, you know, people get very literal. I know. Substantial amount of weight to lose. You probably should just stay in a nice, modest deficit and train like you're building

32:32muscle. Yes. And here's the funny thing. Training's not going to change that, if at all. You know, train because you can build some muscle under layers of fat. Yes, you can, especially if you're newer to training. And so why wouldn't you try? Why would you not even attempt to build muscle while you're in a deficit? So if you have a lot of weight to lose, you're better off losing your fat first. And then when you're ready, slowly bring calories back in to where you find your little maintenance bubble. And that's where I would start people at.

33:04Start building at maintenance first, right? If you don't have much weight to lose at all, then I'd say you need to turn that corner right now and get into maintenance. You know, the people, the last five, 10 pound kind of people, people get really obsessed with that. And I don't think people understand that what you're going to have to do to lose those last five pounds are not. It's not going to be what you did to lose the first five pounds. It's not going to be remotely close. It's going, the reins are going to be pulled in tighter.

33:35You have hardly any, if any, wiggle room anymore. Going out with friends and family, all that. You got to take a hard look at that. Stuff like that for five pounds. You have to evaluate how much that is really going to be worth it. I always tell people, you're going to be happier if you get your calories to maintenance and now shift your focus to building muscle and get it off of losing weight and nutrition and blah, blah, blah. Keep your maintenance, nutrition going, learn to live there, and now give yourself some

34:05very specific performance-based goals and start really training, not working out anymore. We're not checking a box. We're training towards something. And that changes everything. And then take pictures of yourself while you're doing this every four weeks so you can look at the first day compared to day 90, let's say. And because you won't see the changes in the mirror as much as you probably would like to. But when you put these pictures side by side, you're like, holy crap, I look completely different. Well, you won't in 90 days, but you get the drift.

34:38You will see changes that you wouldn't see every single day had you not taken pictures. So I think it just depends on where the person is. And I also say, you can also think of it this way. People say, can I lose weight, build muscle at the same time? You could do periods of a deficit, three months, three months of muscle building. At the end of six months, you did both. You look at it in a bigger time piece. Yes. Great answer. That's all in alignment.

35:09All the things that we say over at Warrior Babe and the things that we speak to. And I love that you're just so in alignment with all of that information. So can we switch back really quick? You talked about in that answer there, doing almost like the boring work inside the gym. Not much training is going to change here. If you're losing a significant amount of weight or even in general, people think that they should go in and they change their workout plan tomorrow.

35:39You mentioned it too earlier. You're like, ah, people just follow a program. They go into the gym and they do a different workout each single day or each and every single week. So can you talk to like a little bit about why progressive overload is like so important or like sticking to a program for a long period of time? Why that's so important when it comes to the ultimate goal of putting on more muscle to the body? Yeah. You know, I think one thing we don't do well generally is to track progress in our workouts, right? Especially if you do classes, you can't track your, I mean, how you do that really in classes.

36:13And I tell people you really need to be as attentive to tracking your progress in your workouts as you do with your nutrition. You know, you're weighing your food, you're counting calories, you're doing protein, blah, blah, blah. And you're keeping all the data, but yet you're just going in and working out and going home, right? And so if you want to make progress over time, and we hear progressive overload is basically making progress over time in some way, shape, or form. And the most common form is to add weight, but you can add repetitions, add repetitions

36:43at the same weight. I mean, there's lots of ways to get better. Essentially, you want to improve. Just break it down into something very, very simple. It just means you're getting better. Somehow or another, you are getting better. Maybe you're adding more weight. Maybe you did another set, whatever it is. But I think we have to keep track of all of this because how are we going to know? Like if you don't even write down how much weight you moved that day, you're not going to have any idea of, wait a minute, was I using 15 or 20?

37:15Or, you know, you're going to really kind of hold yourself back from making progress, I think, because you're very unsure where you were. So, you know, track your workouts and always work to push that envelope. Somehow, shape, or form. That's my progressive overload in my head, right? I'm constantly trying to move it one notch. And maybe there's going to be days where you can't move it at all. That's perfectly normal. You know, training's not linear either. Just like losing weight's not a straight line. You know, getting strong and building muscle's not a straight line either.

37:47And you're going to have periods where you think nothing's working. My deadlifted for a while, stayed the same for almost eight months. And so I could, you know, beef it up. But I didn't stop. I didn't say it's not working. I just kept going, you know. And that's the simplicity of the building muscle thing. You know, it is kind of simple in concept. You take basic movements. All my movements that I do are just basic movement patterns. There's nothing crazy that I have ever done. And I do variations of different things here and there.

38:21But it's the same movement patterns every single. I've been doing that for years, right? And I've tracked every single one of my workouts. So I could, if I could pull up what I started deadlifting with and what I currently deadlift with. You know, I mean, and I think when you're building muscle, this is, this is the scale. The thing that we usually go to, the scale is not going to be a big help for us here. I mean, it's just not. But pictures and then tracking our progress and looking, oh my God, I started this program and I only could lift 10 pounds.

38:53I'm ending this program and I've doubled what I lifted. You know, that's what it's about. And how you're going to feel when you start seeing stuff like that, that's something that words don't do justice to describe that feeling. I don't think until you feel it. And then you're like, holy shit. You feel like a badass. You feel like it just gives you this sense of confidence that goes through your whole life. You will see other areas of your life. All of a sudden, you sit a little taller.

39:25You know, all of a sudden, not afraid to speak your mind. Just, it, it, it just permeates everything. And that's, that's significant, especially as we get older. I feel like, I think that's something we all need. So. A hundred percent. And I love that because it's, it's even more to the, what we spoke to earlier as to why building muscle is so beneficial. It's, you know, to all the things that we spoke to with like the muscle is the organ of longevity and it makes you live longer. And you get to be running around with your grandkids and all of the things.

39:55But even for you as a human, you gain so much confidence. You feel so good. You have newfound energy from doing all of those things. From eating right, feeling your body the right way and lifting some weight and challenging yourself. It's you versus you in that moment. It's like, it's either you, you're going to pick up the weight and you're going to challenge yourself to move it. Or you're going to stay stagnant and just go through the motion. So which one do you want to choose? Yeah, exactly. And I also want to add to people, you know, building muscle takes more time than losing fat.

40:28No, it really does. And I understand it can be frustrating to a lot of people because you don't have the validation that we all like to have as human beings. Right. We don't always have that. And that's why I tell people to give yourself a specific goal in the gym is super helpful for this. Super helpful. Because it now, it does give you something tangible. Like you want to get your first chin up, let's say.

40:58That is a training goal. You're now training. You're not working out. You are training because you want to get that first chin up. And let's say you've been using chin up assist bands and you were using the real thick one. And one day you decide, I'm going to put on that purple one. I want to see if I can do any with the purple one. And you can start flying up there with less help on your chin ups. You've gotten stronger. And you just had validation right there. Right in that instant. You made progress. You're going to be more motivated to keep going, you know, and work hard.

41:33And you're just going to keep that wheel spinning, which is what you want. And I love that you spoke to that because so many people want instant gratification, right? They want to pop their body into microwave and like outcome out in 30 seconds comes like a tone muscular body. I always joke about that. I'm like, that's not the way it works when it comes to building muscle. But your point here, you can find instant gratification in the way you're going to be training for things inside of the gym. You set this non-scale victory or non-composition, what your body is going to look like.

42:04And you say, I want to do a muscle up or a chin up. And so you set this number, you set that goal and you can go in the gym and now you're training towards that and you can feel it. And like, if you're eating right and doing all the right things in like a week or two weeks, you may have hit one more chin up than you did the previous two weeks, you know? And that's some instant gratification that you're going to find quicker than what you may find when you're trying to build muscle to your body, which is going to be a significant amount of time. And, you know, building muscle, I ask people what their goal is and they say they want to build muscle. Well, that's a big generic goal, right?

42:34And I always ask them to give me something else that's a little bit more slimmed down and tangible for them, right? And because you really have to think for building muscle, you have to think in years. You know, it's not a month. And I bring this up because I post my transformation picture, if you want to call it that, to different ones frequently. And I always get asked how long in between the two. That's what the first thing everyone wants to know, how long. And I don't know.

43:05And that's legitimate. I have no idea when that first picture was taken. And people are stunned by that. Wow. And I said, how can you not know? I said, well, I could figure it out. I was running a race. I could look up the year that that race was. That I could do. And I do just to give them a number. I said, but the point is, I was so caught up in, I wanted to get a chin up. I wanted to be able to deadlift a certain number of weight. I had lost track of time. I didn't care anymore.

43:36And you're still working towards it, right? You're still doing it. There's no end point. There's no deadline to you building. No. I always like to say, it's like, when you think about that phrase, I want to build muscle and change the way my body looks or change my body composition or whatever. I'm like, that is a lot to unpack. Let's pull it in. Like you're saying, reel it in a little bit closer and let's do the things that are going to get you there, right? And look at the daily small wins that will help you over time compound into that ultimate goal. But yeah, to your point, it's like, I mean, people ask me that same question.

44:07I'm like, I'm still going. Like it doesn't stop. Like it didn't, it started somewhere, but like, I don't know at what point, maybe a couple of years in that I started seeing the changes that I want, but a couple of years to preface that. And then it's like, I'm still going. So like, I still work on like some parts of my body that I want to build and change and all of that. So like, why it's like long, it's the, it's a, it's, there's no destination, right? Like people were like, they want, and that's the thing too, with like the yo-yo and like the diet culture.

44:37It's like, I want to get to a goal, right? Which I love when it comes to like training and all that stuff. Great. Keep hitting those goals, but people want goals with their body. And I feel like it like creates this all or nothing mentality of like, I'm going to get here. And then what you stop just like marathon people. If they like run in a marathon, it's like, they just stop. So can you share your insight on what, you know, the journey means to you? Like why you do this really, I guess is my question. You know, it's so funny. Cause I've been driven by the little goals for so long.

45:11Oh, that looks cool. I mean, it's nothing more, you know, people, I don't know if people are expecting this real deep answer, but I'm kind of like, you know, I wanted to do a chin up. My whole life, you know, I was heavy my whole life. I was that kid in elementary PE that couldn't do the arm hang. You know, I didn't have enough strength to do an arm hang. And now I, you know, I worked towards a 45 pound weighted chin up and, and I had a little bit of a shoulder injury, you know? So, well, you know, it's so interesting because my shoulder, I have a weird shoulder and it

45:46was rear and it's ugly head. So I had to kind of rebuild my chin ups and I'm in the process of rebuilding. So here it is again, I'm going to be knocking on the door of that 45 pound again. I've learned from the first time I did, I, the frequency was too much as I'm getting older. I've got to space it out more and more. You know, I've got to put a day, maybe two in, in between weighted chin up days. I've just, I've learned that first time around the hard way, I guess. So now I'm in rebuild mode, you know? And so I'm just working to get, I want to get like three or four reps with that thing

46:17strapped to my waist one day. So I'm working towards that. I'm rowing 90 pound dumbbell. I want to do a hundred. That's my big goal there. You know, I, I mean, I have these goals. Why, why a dumbbell row? I don't know. I just, you know, I just think it would be fun. And then most recently I started jujitsu. I started jujitsu at 62. So bad. You started at 62. Wow. Yeah. Yeah. And I was terrified. I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just,

46:49I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I just, I was the, you know, jujitsu, oh my God, I mean, it's, it's very similar to wrestling, yeah, okay, and I'm doing one-on-one private lessons, I haven't done classes, I'm going to

47:25start classes actually next week, and I have a lump in my stomach, I'm thinking about going into a class, but I know I need to do it, and I know I'm going to benefit a lot from it, so I kind of do it, but I, the first time I walked in for jujitsu, you know, I was terrified, I didn't know what to expect, I am, my instructor's a male, and a lot of people get weirded out by that, and it, I don't even, it doesn't even cross my head anymore, my whole mindset has shifted, but it was a lot of feeling

47:55uncomfortable, and it's so interesting, because Jordan told me this one time, and I feel like it, this is so true, when there is something in front of you that, to do, let's say, something you want to try, but you don't want to try, and then I can't, I can't, you know, and deep downsize, because you're scared shitless to do it, you need to do it, that's something that you need to do, you know, and you'll never regret doing it, you know, you're going to learn so much, you may not continue with it, cool, that's fine, but you will never regret doing it, trying it, and you will regret

48:28not trying it, because then you'll never know, you will never ever know, and that's kind of how it was with jujitsu, because you know, Jordan's really big into jujitsu, and he has been talking with me for so long about it, and said, I think you're going to like it, I think, but if you don't, don't worry about it, blah, blah, blah, and so I finally did it, literally, I drove over there, cold knocked on the door, basically, that is awesome, and signed up, and started the next day, and I go two to three times a week, so. That is amazing, that is an inspiration to many people, Susan, especially just for the go-getter

49:02mentality, like, just go do it, you won't know until you try, and like you said, you won't regret trying, you may not stick to it, but like, you tried, at least you know the answer. Exactly, exactly, I'm kind of, my perspective on life at this age, and it shifts, has shifted a lot, like, I realized my life continuum is not as long as it used to be, and I really don't want to be one of those people who has a ton of regrets like that, like, I wish I had tried that, I don't want to be like that, I mean,

49:36we all have life regrets, I'm not even talking about that kind of stuff, but stuff that, man, why didn't I try that, you know, back when I could, or whatever, I don't want to, I don't want to ever be like that. Especially when it comes to, I think that's a really good thing to talk about and elaborate here really quick, especially when it comes to your health, and trying things in regards to your health, and making you physically better, because I like to paint this picture with our community, it's like, think about your body at 70, it could be either two ways for you here, it could literally, if you're someone that's not trying things for your health, and your fitness, and you're kind of just

50:09like stagnant, you're comfortable, you're doing the, you're not really doing anything to make your body healthy and strong, that could be a different look at age 70, as opposed to somebody who is doing the things and trying the things and getting their feet wet in jujitsu. And like, you know, even just like going for a walk, and then incorporating strength training, and like, then adding and stacking on better habits for you, your agent, your bot or your body at 70 could look completely different than Oh, absolutely. I think it's so funny, with all the talk of longevity, that's a real big

50:41piece of it. And a lot of research shows that when we hit 75, there's a sharp decline for all of us. But those of us that are working prior to that, our decline is much less, we're all going to have it. But, and that that got my attention very quickly. Yeah. When I heard that from a couple different medical people, that we all have this cliff. And it's just how steep is it going to be? Yeah. And I want

51:14mine to be as flat as possible. Yeah. Well, you remind me that train with Joan, isn't she like the one that's like 80 and ripped? And like, you know, she's got muscle. Yeah. And the other bodybuilder, I forget her name. Yeah, yeah. So you remind me, you're, you, you're definitely an inspiration to the women that are and I know, I'm sure you already know that, but just to reiterate it to the women that are your age and, you know, don't think they can do it, but it's like, no, let's get out of that mentality. And like, you can do it. It's never too late. You can do it. That's kind of my mission now is to kind of

51:45hopefully lead the way, set the, you know, lead by example and, and convince everybody that it isn't too late. You know, it does take work though. And, and that you got it. You got to be ready to do. I mean, it's going to take work no matter how old you are. Um, but it will take work, but it's not, it's not such an outrageous amount of work or the kind of work, whatever you will, you can do it. You just need to decide that this is a priority for you and that you want to do it. And you start, you have to take action. Love it. All of that is so true. Susan, I think that's a good spot to wrap

52:20up because it's so inspiring. And I want women to get to get off of this podcast and be like, all right, I'm gonna go take some action right now. I need to go eat right. I need to go grocery shopping. Like they feel super empowered by you and your message. And I feel like that was very powerful and impactful. And I know that's your mission to help women break through that mindset. So let them know where they can find you, where are you at, your book, mention that for them too. Sure. Um, you'll find me mostly on Instagram and it's Susan Niebuhrball fitness. Um, I have a YouTube channel that has a lot of great

52:51resources. I try to uncomplicate a lot of stuff over on YouTube, um, Facebook too. Um, I have a podcast as well called the strong and lean at any age podcast. Jordan and I are regulars on his and mine actually. Um, and my book is called, um, fit at any age. It's never too late. And you can find that on Amazon. Amazing. Awesome. Thank you so much, Susan, for being here again. Appreciate you and your insight and your golden nuggets and thank you. Yeah. I appreciate it. Thank you so much for having me. This is great. Real quick. The only ask I could ever have of you guys is to help spread the word

53:25so we can help more women lose body fat, build muscle, reach their goals and feel insanely confident. And the only way we can do that is if you rate review and share this podcast. So the single thing I ask for you to do is if you could leave a review, it will take you 10 seconds and it will mean the absolute world to me and may change the world of someone else.

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